Annoying Game Questions You Want Answered

ishy · Post by **ishy** » Sat May 24, 2014 8:56 am

No

Multiple Metamagic Feats on a Spell

A spellcaster can apply multiple metamagic feats to a single spell. Changes to its level are cumulative. You can’t apply the same metamagic feat more than once to a single spell.

Schleiermacher · Post by **Schleiermacher** » Sat May 24, 2014 10:36 am

Thank you.

erik · Post by **erik** » Sat May 24, 2014 12:52 pm

Schleiermacher wrote:Just for the record: Can you apply the same metamagic feat to a spell multiple times?

I think the answer is "no", but I don't know where the rules address that.

The rule quoted by ishy is from 3.5. In 3e stacking empower was totally legit and 3e covers a lot of 3rd party games as well.

Schleiermacher · Post by **Schleiermacher** » Sat May 24, 2014 3:02 pm

Yeah, that's what had me confused.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Sun May 25, 2014 10:33 am

I'm looking at introducing astrology into my game, mostly using some stuff from Dragon magazine (Optimal careers and Lucky Actions and birthstones which give bonuses; bonuses based on what kind of moon or sun you were born under) because I think they're interesting, and in a fantasy setting it's actually entirely possible that astral events could in fact influence people.

The problem is that Dragon used feats to confer those benefits and they're too fucking small to actually spend feats on. They might, however, be worth spending a bit of gold on (you go and get anointed by the astrologer, or something).

What would be appropriate costs the following packages?

+1 on 2 skills, +1 on a given save, additional +1 on saves of given type against a specific effect
+1 on 2 skills, a 1st level spell like usable once per day (or Detect Thoughts once per day)
+2 on 2 skills, (+2 vrs an specific effect/+1 AC agaisnt a specific attack or under a specific condition/+2 AC against crit confirms if you keep a stone worth at least 100g with you)

rasmuswagner · Post by **rasmuswagner** » Sun May 25, 2014 12:02 pm

Prak_Anima wrote:I'm looking at introducing astrology into my game, mostly using some stuff from Dragon magazine (Optimal careers and Lucky Actions and birthstones which give bonuses; bonuses based on what kind of moon or sun you were born under) because I think they're interesting, and in a fantasy setting it's actually entirely possible that astral events could in fact influence people.

The problem is that Dragon used feats to confer those benefits and they're too fucking small to actually spend feats on. They might, however, be worth spending a bit of gold on (you go and get anointed by the astrologer, or something).

What would be appropriate costs the following packages?
+1 on 2 skills, +1 on a given save, additional +1 on saves of given type against a specific effect

+1 on 2 skills, a 1st level spell like usable once per day (or Detect Thoughts once per day)

+2 on 2 skills, (+2 vrs an specific effect/+1 AC agaisnt a specific attack or under a specific condition/+2 AC against crit confirms if you keep a stone worth at least 100g with you)

Do they stack? Specifically, +1 to one kind of save, stackable, is far more valuable than anyhing else on this list.

My gut says 250-500 gp.

ACOS · Post by **ACOS** » Sun May 25, 2014 8:39 pm

Those are all pretty standard arrays for "background feats"; which, yeah, are way too small to be wasting feats on.
I've even been known to just throw those around for free at character creation as just "backgrounds", as part of a comprehensive character-generation process.

If you wanted some type of resource expenditure, maybe just have them unlock the ability via some sort of ceremony or something. I think that rasmuswagner is about right for the cost of material components of such a ceremony.

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Sun May 25, 2014 9:02 pm

Yeah, I figured a ceremony would be fine.

Dragon made them untyped. The first two categories are mutually exclusive, being "Born under a [] Sun/Moon" feats.

I should have given an example:

Sign of the Basilisk
Dour and often gloomy, those born under the sign of the basilisk expect the worst, yet this endows them with an uncanny foresight and independence. As stubborn as stone, people find it difficult to change your mind. Your tendency to hold grudges, seeking revenges for imagined slights even years later, leaves most holding you at arm's length. However your tenacity, innate common sense, and problem-solving abilities often make you the person others turn to in moments of crisis.
Optimal career: You possess a glare like a basilisk, granting you a +2 on intimidate checks.
Lucky Action: A skeptic, you make an excellent watchman or purchaser of goods, giving you a +2 on Sense Motive checks.
Birthstone: Ruby, the stone of substance, protecting property and flesh, grants you a +2 on any Fortitude save against transmutation spells and effects.

Born Under a Rising Sun [Birth]
You were born at dawn and display gifts associated with it--such as a hopeful spirit and a strong will.
Benefits: You receive a +1 bonus on all Heal skill checks, and a +1 bonus on Will saving throws. On saves to resist a fear effect, you receive an additional +1 for a total of +2.
(Apparently I mistyped before, the sun feats only give +1 on a single skill).

Born Under The New Moon [Birth]
You were born under the new moon. The invisible moon allows you to more easily hide your actions and your true form from others.
Benefits: You gain a +1 bonus on Hide and Sleight of Hand checks and, once per day, you can use disguise self as a spell like ability. Your caster level for this spell-like ability is your character level.

Dragon made the Signs three feats-- Startouched (get your Optimal Career bonus, also allows creation of Star Forged* items for you sign), Starborn (get your Lucky Action bonus, reroll your Lucky Action skill once per day), and Starblessed (get your Birthstone bonus, use your Lucky Action reroll an additional time per day).

*Star Forged items are just items where some or all of the bonuses only work people of a specific sign.

ACOS · Post by **ACOS** » Sun May 25, 2014 10:21 pm

Yeah, the Born Under Sun/Moon feats are the stuff of ceremonies.
The star-touched chain can easily be combined in to a single feat, and still be not quite worth it (seriously? 3 f'n feats? WTF? the follow-on prestige class is really only worth 3 feats or so). So, combine the 3 in to 1 single feat, and give them a scaling effect (e.g., increase the bonus by 1/5 levels or something).

rampaging-poet · Post by **rampaging-poet** » Tue May 27, 2014 12:05 am

I seem to remember something about D&D spell effects stacking in whatever way is most favourable to [character], but can't remember where it is or whether it's the caster or the target that gets to pick the order of operations. Does that rule actually exist? If so, where is it?

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Tue May 27, 2014 11:03 pm

I have this image in mind for a goblin who runs a fighting ring in my campaign, which I could swear my mind pulled from having actually seen. Basically, Tyler Durden, if Brad Pitt were a goblin, so a goblin in a fur coat over a bare chest, dark glasses, etc.

I need better google fu than mine, so if anyone can find it, or knows what my mind is pulling the image from, the help would be appreciated.

fectin · Post by **fectin** » Wed May 28, 2014 3:10 am

like this?
http://media.blizzard.com/wow/media/art ... -large.jpg

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Wed May 28, 2014 4:15 am

Sort of, but not really. No worries, I'm back near my sketch book, so I'll draw something up.

Count Arioch the 28th · Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:39 am

Two questions, pathfinder system.

1. A medium character insists on riding a large creature in a space designed for medium creatures. What is a reasonable ruling?

2. Said character rode the creature underwater while waterbreathing was going. I ruled that since it wasn't aquatic, it was still freaked the fuck out and he had to "push" it to do anything. In your opinion, is that ruling justified?

Prak · Post by **Prak** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:50 am

Assuming horse-like creature here-

1- Ref Save 15 when going through doors, failure means 1d4 nonlethal. Unless you mean a corridor that is about 7-10' high, and maybe 5-7' wide, in which case, 1 nonlethal/minute riding (as his head and legs are rubbed raw by ceiling/walls), must push after first minute (I can't imagine a horse is going to be cool with a 7'x7' corridor for any real period of time). If still in close confines after about 10 minutes, I'd consider having the horse go crazy, and force a ride check to keep it under control. Oh, and as the horse is bucking around in a small space with a guy on it's back, said guy is taking 1d6 real damage per round as he's slammed into every nearby surface.

Disclaimer: The amount of time I've spent with horses in my entire life would probably add up to less than a day. Week tops. Not counting living next to people with a horse I almost never interact with.

2- Yes, I imagine even a horse that could breath would be freaking out if submerged underwater. Though I also imagine it would realize it was safe fairly quickly, and would basically reduce the Push DC by 5 after about a minute or two.

angelfromanotherpin · Post by **angelfromanotherpin** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 1:58 am

Squeezing

In some cases, you may have to squeeze into or through an area that isn’t as wide as the space you take up. You can squeeze through or into a space that is at least half as wide as your normal space. Each move into or through a narrow space counts as if it were 2 squares, and while squeezed in a narrow space you take a -4 penalty on attack rolls and a -4 penalty to AC.

When a Large creature (which normally takes up four squares) squeezes into a space that’s one square wide, the creature’s miniature figure occupies two squares, centered on the line between the two squares. For a bigger creature, center the creature likewise in the area it squeezes into.

A creature can squeeze past an opponent while moving but it can’t end its movement in an occupied square.

To squeeze through or into a space less than half your space’s width, you must use the Escape Artist skill. You can’t attack while using Escape Artist to squeeze through or into a narrow space, you take a -4 penalty to AC, and you lose any Dexterity bonus to AC.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 3:47 am

1) Squeezing rules, cited above. Would say the rider is squeezing too.

2) No, that is stupid as shit. You didn't specify the creature, so there is a lot of wiggle room, but when you shove a goddam piece of wood in a horses mouth it throws a fit... for about a minute. Getting it underwater should be hard. Once it realizes that it can damn well breath just fine, it can just walk around on the ocean floor with the penalties for moving under water, and there is no reason to arbitrarily add a punch of rolls that don't do anything.

fectin · Post by **fectin** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 10:55 pm

What's the deal with scouts? (3.5 base class)

Is there any way to make them less sucky? (looking for in-game mostly, like some wondrous item that makes them magically okay)

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Thu Jun 05, 2014 11:06 pm

fectin wrote:What's the deal with scouts? (3.5 base class)

Is there any way to make them less sucky? (looking for in-game mostly, like some wondrous item that makes them magically okay)

I think you can do something with like a couple level dip or something and magically get a swift action teleport, and then they are basically just shittier rouges without the 30ft rule (I fucking hope, I don't remember off hand).

AndreiChekov · Post by **AndreiChekov** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:04 am

Kaelik wrote:
fectin wrote:What's the deal with scouts? (3.5 base class)

Is there any way to make them less sucky? (looking for in-game mostly, like some wondrous item that makes them magically okay)
I think you can do something with like a couple level dip or something and magically get a swift action teleport, and then they are basically just shittier rouges without the 30ft rule (I fucking hope, I don't remember off hand).

They still have it. And skirmish doesn't work with a full attack action because they have to move 10 ft. to activate it.

AndreiChekov · Post by **AndreiChekov** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:06 am

Now that I think about it, you could fix most of the problems by:

-making so that every skirmish upgrade is a d6 more of damage.
-removing the 30 ft. limit
-and giving them a way to move 10 ft. as a swift action.

RadiantPhoenix · Post by **RadiantPhoenix** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:06 am

AndreiChekov wrote:They still have it. And skirmish doesn't work with a full attack action because they have to move 10 ft. to activate it.

Can't you swift+full?

EDIT: just in case you missed it, I'm pretty sure that's what the swift teleport thing was for.

erik · Post by **erik** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:21 am

If you want to make a scout not be a pile of ass, you have to change the class.

Starting with suggestions as Andrei noted seems reasonable. They'll still need some magical ju-ju. No reason why they shouldn't have UMD too.

TiaC · Post by **TiaC** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 4:11 am

There's a feat that allows Ranger to advance skirmish.

A level of cleric can get you Travel Devotion. A level of monk and a Sparring Dummy of the Master gives you 10' steps. Pounce obviously works.

Kaelik · Post by **Kaelik** » Fri Jun 06, 2014 5:33 am

AndreiChekov wrote:And skirmish doesn't work with a full attack action because they have to move 10 ft. to activate it.

If only they took a few level dips for a swift round teleport or something. Or if only I specifically fucking said that asfter you do that.